A question for Kerry supporters

[Ryo of Inferno]

Well Cidien don't know much about Lieberman but depends on his character. Everyone is

bringing up good points and counterpoints but I'd have to agree with Cidien. Kerry is a

traitor and a sellout. He keeps saying everything that Bush does is wrong. If this is true

why does he keep pushing the fact that he got three purple hearts and that he was in the

military? I'm more of an independent than republican but it seems that at least for now

the republicans are making more sense than the Democrats. Even some democrats are

willing to vote for Bush instead of Kerry. That says sometjing to me right there. Kerry

needs to stand firm on a principal and not change his views on a whim. Seriously, anyone

who trusts Kerry is gonna regret it later. No matter what side your on though id suggest

trying to find what little humour is in this election. Check out http://www.jibjab.com and look at

this land is my land. I like to call this todays politics in a nutshell. As for Lieberman id

have to know more about him Cidien before i said yes or no and Zagtto srry about our

opposing views, no insult was intended thx for the help earlier. Cidien like to see what u

have to say about Lieberman though cause usually i only pay attention to the main

candidates. Please fill me in about him when you get the time.

[Vicious]

Cidien, I almost handed out a ban for this comment. It's only because Morgorath put that on the table that I didn't.

You can't hand out bans because someone makes comments you don't agree with, no matter how poorly worded it is or how much it offends you (especially if it's related to politics).

[Cidien]

Well I like Lieberman because he's the most honest politician I know. He has morals and he sticks to them. He supports the war against terror and the war in Iraq. He's one of the few democrats that will stand up today and say so. I disagree with some of his views such as Lieberman is pro-infanticide ("partial birth abortion"). However, he is an honest man with strong morals and that's what I find most important when deciding who I will want to vote for.

If you want to know anything specific about Lieberman just do a google search. It's usually not too hard to find where people stand.

[Cidien]

Cidien, I almost handed out a ban for this comment. It's only because Morgorath put that on the table that I didn't.

I don't agree with the decision to send our troops over seas. I believe it is a waste of human life on both sides of the battle.

I do support our troops while they are doing the job they were sent to do. We train our people to become good soldiers and uphold the decisions of our nations leader. It's up to our troops to behave honorably and rationally in the field. With people like Morg over there I have a bit more hope that we can accomplish that.

On what grounds do you call them traitors?
Traitor is a severe word to use and can have strong consequences.


"Yes, the more we kill them the more powerful they become... I still don't understand this logic."
Do you understand the term MARTYR? It's when somebody chooses to die to support their cause. As we wage wholesale war on "terrorists" we put them in the limelight which is where they wanted to be. Once the media is trained on the situation then sympathisers start building up. Sure, Al Qaeda is out of commission but how many other organizations are forming and biding their time?

How long did the IRA practice terrorism in the UK? If you watch movies made within the last 10 years or so you can find many instances where they are portrayed as heros.

It's the shortsightedness of people like you that continue to think that terrorism is something that can be defeated by blowing people up and killing leaders. The sad truth is it will be decades before we get to a point where there is even a possibility of ending terrorism. And that would only be if we had a string of intelligent, compassionate leaders working at the root causes for why terrorists do what they do.

You were going to give me a ban for that? Ok...

I don't think terrorism can be defeated by blowing people up. Invading Iraq is but the first step. Now we need schools set up to teach the children of Iraq moral values and we need to teach them about the true nature of their religion. They need to quit being taught their religion tells them to kill americans and other infidels. At the same time we need to continue killing existing terrorists so they can't indoctrinate other children to their cause.

I view terrorism as little different than racism in america. Obviously we can't kill racists, but the situation is much the same. We're educating our people to accept people of other races. The biggest hindrance to this is the older more racist people teaching younger children to be racist themselves. The only thing we can do is continue to education children properly and wait for the extreme racists to die. Although I wouldn't mind hunting down the KKK and neo nazi extremists in our country... they're terrorists just the same as Al Qaeda to me.

[Ryo of Inferno]

Wll Cidien seems i keep missing you, ah well. You seem to bring up some good points.

However claiming that the KKK and the Neo Nazis are terrorists might be a bit extreme.

Id say they were misguided bullies then of course i might be putting it too lightly. As for

Zagattos claim that we cant keep killing people to solve our problem I partly agree with

him. However I agree more with Cidien we must figth for what we believe in lest we

become cowards. If we truly believe something and are willing to fight for it then noone

can take our ideals, our beliefs away. Sorry if im not making any sense but I have a

feeling that you Zagatto would say that America should have kept to itself and not

defended itself when the attack on Pearl Harbor happened. SUr what is happening in the

U.S. is runaway paranoi but considering what happpened i believe it is justified. Most

people believed that what happened at Pearl Harbor was never going to happen again but

it did. How do you think people responded to that? Its an imperfect world and most

people felt a need to find a way to protect themselves. The way to do it distasteful as it

may seem to some is to do as Cidien suggested. However, Cidien overlooks one

important detail. The people who teach the new attitude must be of the same nationality

not Americans or other foreigners. I detest talking about politics too much as it splits

people apart even friends sometimes, but the road to the solution is a narrow one and it is

hard to keep walking on it as we every so often can veer from the true path. We are

human and we are imperfect. Sorry if this sounds religious but its true; also I think ive

been listening to my Hellsng Ruins CD too much anyway id like to see what your guys

thoughts on this are.

[Cidien]

"The people who teach the new attitude must be of the same nationality not Americans or other foreigners."

I agree completely.

[Cidien]

By the way I don't want to get into on what grounds do I call them traitors too much because i've already answered that previously when talking about Kerry here and on several other boards. If an american soldier was to come back and denounce the war and throw away their ribbons and/or medals i'd consider them a traitor to this country. Those medals don't tell people that you agreed with why the war was fought, they show that you as an individual did something worthwhile when fighting over there. (most of the time) Traitor is a strong word, but I just cant seem to come up with a better word. Piece of shit perhaps? I feel Kerry is a traitor for the way he handled himself when he came back from the war. (after he got into politics anyways....) Again, i've covered that...

[Ryo of Inferno]

Thx for clearing that up Cidien btw do u have AIM at all? As for Kerry he is just proving

the age old idiom: "power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Again if

noone has done it I ask you all to chaeck out www.jibjab.com

this does a good job of putting it in a nutshell. Oh yeah and click on This land is

my land. Hilarious.

[Cidien]

Ya I saw that a long time ago. I don't use AIM anymore 'cuz I don't know anything that still uses it. My MSN address is [email protected] I log on there from time to time.

[Ryo of Inferno]

Dmn sorry about that. Never could get MSN to work for me. Ah well. Can give you my e-

mail if you want. it is [email protected] Well need to

finish watching an anime c ya all tommorrow.

[Cidien]

The pictures from Iraq the media won't ever show you.

http://www.pbase.com/kburch/the_picture_...n_the_news

[Cidien]

The pictures from Iraq the media won't ever show you.

http://www.pbase.com/kburch/the_picture_...n_the_news

Their entire country just hates us soooooo much don't they?

......


bah, meant to hit edit no quote... oh well.

[Atomic Orgasm]

The only reason i'm voting for Kerry is because he's the lesser of two evils.

[Elcoholic]

Their entire country just hates us soooooo much don't they?

......
.

Yes they do.

Can I ask you one last question before I go offline for the weekend Cidien?

In my opinion and other analist opinions the war with Iraq has fed the ideal groups like al-quaida (sp?) try to spread and use as the reason for attacking the US. It gave them another example and argument to show young recrutes. It has helpt spread hatred towards the US all over the world. You might be killing terrorists all over the world but the ideal these people embrace has only been fed and cannot be wiped out through violence. I think they will keep being created as long as the US keeps taking measures in their own hand. Regarding the topic of this thread I think whoever will become president will have a much harder time keeping the country safe because of the war. (I wonder how people would respond if the next airplane that drills itself in a skyscraper was flown by an Iraqi).

This is why I think the war in Iraq and the way it was fought was the wrong decission to fight terrorism. What's your thoughts about this?

[Zagatto]

Just to clarify why I would consider a ban for calling someone a traitor.
I believe that to be an even more offensive word than asshole, fucker, shithead or similar words.
The definition of traitor is someone who betrays his country by committing treason.
Throwing out medals or denouncing a government is stating an opinion. That's something that is not only legal in the US but it is also encouraged with our Bill of Rights.

By calling someone a traitor, you are saying that they have betrayed our land and worked towards the downfall of the country in some way. That is a tall claim to make and very offensive to anyone who has served our country in ANY capacity.

It seemed to me that you may not have known the gravity of your statement which is part of the reason I didn't give the ban for that remark at that time. Unless you can come up with some sort of proof of a treasonous act having been performed, I don't want to see anyone called a traitor. It's not a word to bandy about lightly.