most influential anime

[Mantis421]

Thanks for the corection on my Post about Voltron and Gundam. I am not perfect and not a ZenMaster when it comes to my anime smarts. Making the point though usually unless it is Dubed or embraced by Disney. For Example I have been lucky enough to see episodes of newer anime Full Metal Alchimist and Molly Star Chaser (only the Pilot) but these will most likely not hit the US market for years let alone at all. Makes you wonder if the bigest influence on anime is not the series themselves but the TV networks and distributers telling us what to like not the other way around llike it should be

[Cidien]

Originally posted by hbk101
How can you say that what influenced anime in america? For one thing, we don't even make animes. So we can only influence our anime viewing habits, not anime itself.

Actually if it had not been for american viewers it's likely a second season for big o would not have happened. We do have an influence on anime, just not a very big one. I think this will change in the future, but we will have to wait and see about that.

And it was my mistake, I thought he meant what animes have had the greatest influence in america.

[hbk101]

Originally posted by Cidien
Actually if it had not been for american viewers it's likely a second season for big o would not have happened.

Can you elaborate on this?

[Cidien]

Alright last post for real before I head to bed lol. Do a search. It's been explained several times in different posts and can probably be looked up on google as well. Big o was not very popular in japan but was in america thanks to a decent time slot on CN. the american market pushed for a second season of big o to be made, not the japanese market.

[hbk101]

If it is specifically made for American market, I am not sure if I can consider that as an anime. A good example is "Transformer." Is transformer considered as an anime?

P.S. Looked up on some stuff about Big O. It even looks like a typical American cartoon. No wonder........

[Mantis421]

hbk101 you are right about how Transformers is questionably an anime. Overal there always seems to be a set of rules that all anime follow not religiously but pretty close. Artwork and story wise that defines all anime. I do think it would be posible for an american company to make an anime, the real question is can you think of any that how the money or are willing to take a chance on making one. Though in a Post earlier I mentioned the new series "Molly Star Chaser" which is due out soon in Japan. It is a cooperation between Bandi and Save The World Productions which is a French company. Because it was not 100% made in Japan or Asia does it not mean it still can be clasifies as anime. If it looks the same and still can hold a candle against other series it should seriously be considered anime

[Robojack]

Quit bringing up the Big O, it's the only argument I've heard whenever I argue how there's no industry for anime in North America at the moment. Every time, I get the same answer, "Well, look at Big O, that was partially influenced by North America." It's like Xbox owners who constantly use Halo or KOTOR as reasons why Xbox is so much better than PS2.

Big O was an awful series, and it's second season seemed to have been made in half-hearted commitment. It's an awful example of how Americans can influence anime. Now, if North American viewers can influence something as large as the proper conclusion of Rurouni Kenshin series with the addition of the Enishi arc, now THAT would be quite significant of an achivement, as Kenshin was incredibly successful in Japan.

Transformers is NOT an anime, as it was created by Hasbro. However, there have been times where Japanese studios obtained the license to create various anime series of it. Fundamentally, at its very root, it is NOT an anime, since the original series was American-originated (though many credit its creation due to the overwhelming popularity of the Macross-ripped Robotech's transforming planes).

Note that in a traditional sense, an 'anime' is normally reserved for series where it's creation and animation is Japanese in origin. Many series these days use Korean animators (cause they're cheaper than Japanese) to work on parts of various scenes in anime. However, using cheaper labor often means a loss in consistency and quality of animation at times, so it's still limitedly used. Just because a series is partially made in a French studio doesn't make it any less of an anime, UNLESS its director and/or creator is non-Japanese. Then you have something like Cybersix, which was Japanese animated and even directed at times, but was created and scripted by non-Japanese.

Mantis421, my comments were merely to correct your previous statements, not to ridicule you. Either I correct you, or the next person who notices your mistake will. And also, Full Metal Alchemist has been licensed already by Funimation (nooo....the bastards), so it should see release sometime this year or early next.

[hbk101]

Originally posted by Mantis421
Artwork and story wise that defines all anime. I do think it would be posible for an american company to make an anime.........
.............Because it was not 100% made in Japan or Asia does it not mean it still can be clasifies as anime. If it looks the same and still can hold a candle against other series it should seriously be considered anime

Originally posted by Cidien
What are you talking about? Big O is an anime and just because americans pushed for a second season doesn't mean it's an american cartoon... And it isn't anything like typical american cartoons.

BTW the term anime refers to cartoons made in Japan. I actually had to expalin this to my japanese friends. They didn't know we made a distinction between what we call anime and regular cartoons here in america.

I have two conflicting statements here. One says that anime is defined by style. The other says it is defined by "made in Japan"

[Robojack]

It's not about art style that defines whether a series deserve to be called 'anime', but rather it's place of origin. If anything, Japanese artists and mangakas are constantly encouraged to explore and experiment with other styles of drawing. As a result, there is no longer a 'standard' or 'template' that an anime's appearance is based on.

Now, you can all argue logistics, and how the Japanese consider all animation, regardless of origin, to be 'anime'. However, from a general point of view, and in normal anime terms, 'anime' is a French word that is used by the Japanese when referring to animation that comes from, and is conceived in, Japan.

[ArkaidR]

Ok, this is the last time i post before i go to sleep. nothing but trouble. I guess I interpreted the topic wrong so let me clear it up. I was talking about anime that infuenced intrest in America. i don't want this turning into some crazy flame-war so lookee here. Bebop didn't come out ten years ago in the US and cartoons take a long time to develope. So, if there were any animes made influenced by the american release then they should come about in japan in about a year or so. Then agian Japanese people don't care as much as those damn Aussies.




P.S.: If you respond to this post then my response will be:
"Well then I guess I'm dumb ass. I'm gonna go and reflect on getting owned by (your name here)."

[rav96]

Originally posted by ArkaidR

P.S.: If you respond to this post then my response will be:
"Well then I guess I'm dumb ass. I'm gonna go and reflect on getting owned by (your name here)."

I Own You!

[evilomar]

I believe Yamato along with Harlock had a huge impact in Japanese anime, the stories set in space at the time were amazing. Akira's animation and use of color also knocked the hell out of everything at the time. Of course I'm going to go with Miyazaki's direction, and anything written by Osamu Tezuka. American cartoons specially Disney have influenced numerous artist in anime and video games. Everyone brings up Big O because it was a bigger hit here than in Japan, and because it was a huge hit here, CN put money up front for an extra 13 episodes and the second season, regardless of if it sucked or not. A great example of how Americans influence anime is Barefoot Gen, no Americans, no bomb, no movie. Seriously Americans due influence more anime than most people give credit for. If you think that Cowboy Bebop was not influence by American pop culture, you are fucking kidding yourself.

[Zagatto]

Look at what I miss out on by not paying attention to this thread.

I just spent a little while doing some research on the modern definition of "anime" so I wouldn't sound like a fool spouting my opinions as facts.

It's interesting to note that many definitions of anime refer to it as a style of animation originating in Japan but not specifically produced in Japan. Thus shows like Samurai Jack, Aeon Flux, or even the Powerpuff Girls might be considered to be anime even though none of those were produced in Japan.

On the flip side of that coin, the definition provied HERE (click this link dummy) is one of the most thoughrough I've read and even proveds a term new to me "amerime". The interesting thing about the definition from this site is that it points out the Japanese word "anime" is derived from the English word "animation" and the French word "anime" has almost nothing to do with the whole thing.

In Japanese, anime is used to talk about cartoons regardless of nationality.
In English the use of the term anime is more varied and the argument of whether it should be restricted to cartoons produced in Japan will only end up in a flame war. It was easier to define a "Japanese style" ten years ago before we had seen any of the experimental cartoons from there and none of the North American animators had been influenced by what they had seen.

So... going back to the original thread asking what the most influential anime are I'd have to start with the beginning and say the original Disney Cartoons that influenced the style of Astro Boy which influenced a LOT of the cartoons produced for years to come after that. Then we can add Speed Racer, Robotech (or Macross... take your pick), Mazinger, Nausicaa, Sailor Moon, Legend of the Overfiend, Akira, Patlabor, Ninja Scroll, Macross Plus (moreso than Cowboy Bebop), and Ranma 1/2 to name a few (more names are still coming to mind as I sit here).

I would probably enjoy a whole discussion around the use of the word "anime" and whether or not it includes all cartoons of a particular style or if it should be restricted to cartoons actually produced in Japan. Unfortunately, this discussion would be one of opinions and most likely end up in a flame war (as this thread had already started to become).

My personal vote is to adopt the Japanese definition of anime to include all cartoons. If you want cartoons specifically produced in Japan then the term Japanimation seems more appropriate to me.

[Cidien]

Originally posted by Robojack

Big O was an awful series, and it's second season seemed to have been made in half-hearted commitment. It's an awful example of how Americans can influence anime. Now, if North American viewers can influence something as large as the proper conclusion of Rurouni Kenshin series with the addition of the Enishi arc, now THAT would be quite significant of an achivement, as Kenshin was incredibly successful in Japan.

Ah, we get to hear Robojack's infinite anime wisdom once again. You're so right, Big O was an awful series. Oh, wait, actually I like it and it did very well on Cartoon Network. Guess it was a decent series after all.

And it turns out I was right about what he meant this thread to be about. Sometimes you need to think about what kind of person is posting and what they mean instead of exactly how they word something.

[Robojack]

Oh, so now I'm supposed to be psychic, and make assumptions about the thread creator? For one, from the way he conducted himself, I can assume he has the writing skills of a 5th grade student. No, I'd rather take what was written literally, rather than get to know to person in hopes of knowing what he was REALLY saying.

If you people thought Big O to be decent, then that's all the better for you. Apparently for the Japanese audience, it was nothing special, nothing commendable, and nothing worth creating an additional season for. I just happen to agree with this.