06-11-2004, 07:37 AM
Well, you did sort of start the comparisson. And your right, I am comparing the legend of MJ to Kobe now. What I'm trying to say is I think Kobe isn't the player that can carry the team like MJ did of which you gave excelent examples (actually, I think there is no player who can carry a team like he did). I must say that I'm not as up to date with players stats and stuff as I used to be (CNN text used to be my morning paper). I don't even know for sure what position Kobe plays (I assume small forward) now so I'm not fit to discuss this with a fan like you but I'll try. If we talked 8 years ago I could give you all NBA players and the important stats of the starting players (good times) and we could have had a real chat.
I was just surprised to see MJ compared to him or anybody for that matter. He is still a god in my eyes. The stuff he did for the sport. He was the symbol for the sport at the time when bball was my life.
Agreed. But he wasn't just made "the man", he earned it. But if Jordan had Shaq on his team I am not sure he would have taken a back seat. Remember Penny Hardaway and Shaq at Orlando? Penny scored atleast a steady 20 points per game and he and MJ are not in the same league so imagine how much MJ would have scored. Probably less than he did on his own but still alot. Also would have had much more assists. I think they would have made an excelent team. They both need to be double teamed which would have been impossible. Also if they were on the same team from the beginning I think they would have no fingers without rings left. They would be that unbeatable. But this is just what if's.
You can't compare age's since Kobe didn't go to college. MJ won the championship at least once and was also MVP at least once in college if I remeber correct.
Correct, Jordan didn't have anybody on his team. Don't see why this is negative to his person. Jusy shows he DID do it all alone. Once again the biggest differece is that I think nobody can carry a team like he did. Plus MJ mostly played point guard which is (together with center) the position to play if you need to carry a team. I don't think Kobe plays either of these so he will always need a good player to bring him the ball. Later on the Bulls got Pippen, that european guy and Horace Grant and he still scored 30+ easily.
Kobe has 3 rings now because his team is better and MJ had to do it all alone which at that point was to much to ask even from him.
I'll give you Kobe's jumper but I want the ballhandling. What MJ did with the ball while in the air is unbelievable. His timing was perfect in the air and on the ground. And he was the trash talk master which is a skill on itself. And later on in his career (second threepeat) MJ's jumper was an excelent weapon. He also started to hit way more 3 pointers. He was getting older and started to look for new ways to score, which he found.
You want to hear MJ was selfish? He was selfish, in the game atleast. No doubt about it. He knew he was the best and could do anything he wanted when he wanted. Good example was when he came back from his baseball adventure. Those first games the Bulls played with him were purely to get him back into shape. He could throw the ball to the ring from anywhere he wanted, when he wanted. They accepted that if he would miss alot (which he did) they would lose but it would be worth it to get him back in shape. No team would do that today with anyone. Is Phil Jackson still coaching LA? If he is he wouldn't do it to get Kobe back in shape. It would be fun if they would ask him who's better.
The rest is just what if's and we will know when he gets his own team. Its real hard to compare these two. Different times, different teams, different players.
Don't get me wrong, Kobe plays awesome ball. Might even be the best player arround now and at the end of his career (if he doesn't get jailed) he will have more titles than MJ. But MJ is still a living legend and the title of best player ever has been taken by him and I don't think anybody will take it from him anytime soon.
I was just surprised to see MJ compared to him or anybody for that matter. He is still a god in my eyes. The stuff he did for the sport. He was the symbol for the sport at the time when bball was my life.
Quote:Granted, at age 25, Jordan did not have Shaq to play with. That made it tougher on him in terms of winning championships, since he was basically a one man show putting up like 37 points a game. But not having Shaq on his team also made him 'the man' on his team. He instantly became the leader of the the Bulls. Kobe has had to take a backseat to Shaq all these years. If MJ had to have played with someone as established and dominant as Shaq, he would've had to take a backseat as well. He could not have been the leader he was, because Shaq was already established as the leader. That is why Kobe is not the leader that Jordan was.
Agreed. But he wasn't just made "the man", he earned it. But if Jordan had Shaq on his team I am not sure he would have taken a back seat. Remember Penny Hardaway and Shaq at Orlando? Penny scored atleast a steady 20 points per game and he and MJ are not in the same league so imagine how much MJ would have scored. Probably less than he did on his own but still alot. Also would have had much more assists. I think they would have made an excelent team. They both need to be double teamed which would have been impossible. Also if they were on the same team from the beginning I think they would have no fingers without rings left. They would be that unbeatable. But this is just what if's.
You can't compare age's since Kobe didn't go to college. MJ won the championship at least once and was also MVP at least once in college if I remeber correct.
Quote:At age 25, Jordan averaged 37 points a game while Kobe averaged like 25 this season I believe. Jordan had nobody on his team and had to put up all those shots. Kobe is forced to share the ball with Shaq as well as Malone and Payton. If you look at Jordan at 25, he was basically a jacked up version of TMac or AI. He was getting scoring titles, but wasn't going anywhere.
Correct, Jordan didn't have anybody on his team. Don't see why this is negative to his person. Jusy shows he DID do it all alone. Once again the biggest differece is that I think nobody can carry a team like he did. Plus MJ mostly played point guard which is (together with center) the position to play if you need to carry a team. I don't think Kobe plays either of these so he will always need a good player to bring him the ball. Later on the Bulls got Pippen, that european guy and Horace Grant and he still scored 30+ easily.
Quote:Kobe has 3 rings already, and Jordan had 0 at that point. Kobe has a better jumper than Jordan did at that point as well as better ball-handling skills. As good as Kobe's D is, Jordan still had better D than him. In terms of skills, Kobe is better than Jordan at every facet of the game with the exception of defense.
Kobe has 3 rings now because his team is better and MJ had to do it all alone which at that point was to much to ask even from him.
I'll give you Kobe's jumper but I want the ballhandling. What MJ did with the ball while in the air is unbelievable. His timing was perfect in the air and on the ground. And he was the trash talk master which is a skill on itself. And later on in his career (second threepeat) MJ's jumper was an excelent weapon. He also started to hit way more 3 pointers. He was getting older and started to look for new ways to score, which he found.
You want to hear MJ was selfish? He was selfish, in the game atleast. No doubt about it. He knew he was the best and could do anything he wanted when he wanted. Good example was when he came back from his baseball adventure. Those first games the Bulls played with him were purely to get him back into shape. He could throw the ball to the ring from anywhere he wanted, when he wanted. They accepted that if he would miss alot (which he did) they would lose but it would be worth it to get him back in shape. No team would do that today with anyone. Is Phil Jackson still coaching LA? If he is he wouldn't do it to get Kobe back in shape. It would be fun if they would ask him who's better.
The rest is just what if's and we will know when he gets his own team. Its real hard to compare these two. Different times, different teams, different players.
Don't get me wrong, Kobe plays awesome ball. Might even be the best player arround now and at the end of his career (if he doesn't get jailed) he will have more titles than MJ. But MJ is still a living legend and the title of best player ever has been taken by him and I don't think anybody will take it from him anytime soon.