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+--- Thread: Ok we need to Educate (/thread-1391.html)
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Ok we need to Educate - morgorath - 06-16-2003
Ok just finished reading from one of my most Favorite web comics and every now and then I jump into his Red mage answer your e-mails (AKA Twinkin Out) *Oh and for those who don't know I'm talking about 8-bit Theater... Check the link about half way down is a letter by a "Solidus --Three Mounts-- Ardet" This is who anime on Toonami is being market too. After reading his letter and (RM's polite response) I felt sick...
http://www.nuklearpower.com/redmage24.php
Didn't understand the reverse sword in Kenshin or catch the direct link between Everquest and .Hack... No wait he cought the corlation but says this...
Quote:AND what's the deal with Hack/sign ... what the heck is going on? It's like Everquest in cartoon form?!?!
Yes that is what it is...Damn what the hell is going on I'm sharing my passion of anime with people that have no clue of what's going...
Time to set up class and start laying the smack down...
Any ideas on how to educate these people...
Ok we need to Educate - Ka-Talliya - 06-16-2003
There is no help for those who will not help themselves.
Morg , you can only do so much. You can expose them to anime, you can educate them about the differance between anime and cartoons, but perhaps anime is not for all to understand.
Just a select few and the Japanese.
Ok we need to Educate - kakoi_sugoi_yama - 06-17-2003
Some people just don't understand.:mad:
Ok we need to Educate - OptimisticOx - 06-17-2003
Just enjoy it for yourself. and laugh at all others who do not share it. ^_^
Ok we need to Educate - sanosuke - 06-17-2003
its too late for them! dont waste your precious time trying to convert them! its too late i tell you!
Ok we need to Educate - OptimisticOx - 06-17-2003
yeah, actually most of them would probably just find it annoying. there are some people who feel passionately about golf for example and I know that I would be annoyed if one of my golf obsessed friends was always trying to get me to play or watch people play on tv.
Ok we need to Educate - johnkillingsworth - 06-18-2003
I think it's worth a try to convert them. Get them to watch a thoroughly kick ass anime that you think they'll dig on. If they still don't like it then more anime for you, right?
Ok we need to Educate - kakomu - 06-18-2003
anime are cartoons...Just made in Japan. Things like Looney Tunes are the equivelent of Crayon Shin-Chan, and ghibli movies are the same as Disney movies. It just so happens that Japanese cartoons are aimed at teens, and American cartoons are aimed at age groups slightly lower. Also, American cartoons seem to have quite a bit more originality in drawing as anime characters tend to look alike (except for a different hair style, and some sort of facial accessory. In fact, many anime cartoonists attribute different colored hair to being able to distinguish between characters). On another note, Japanese cartoons know the value of babble (whether it be psycho-babble or techno-babble, animes are full of them and all their meaningless terminology). Not to say I hate it, quite the contrary I love the epicness of some shows. But to distinguish Japanese Animation as something beyond cartoons is ludicrous.
Ok we need to Educate - sanosuke - 06-18-2003
anime and cartoons are complete different, just because they are both types of animation doesnt mean they are the same thing. like bacon and sauages are both pork but they aint the same thing (pork sauages before someone points out that there are different types of sauage, and theres another example beef and pork sauages are different yet both sauages). cartoons are animated shows for children and always children, they have simple stories and simple characters and simple themes with simple messages carried by these themes. simple? indeed. because cartoons are aimed at children, anime on the other hand is japanese animation and some of this anime maybe be cartoon. other anime is aimed at teens and adults and this by defination means that it isnt of cartoon nature, it is merely animation. movies like ghost in the shell, akira and patlabor are seen as films in japan, even in america in some certain cases, not cartoons, just films that fall into the catageory of "animated film". anime thats aimed at an older audience have themes that apply to an older audience, stories that apply to an older audience, characters that an older audience can related to, etc. the last ever episode of GTO was the most watched televised event ever in japan (before spirited away was shown), would over a quater of america tune in to watch the last episode of rugrats? is there even a last episode of rugrats? no because its not episodic like most anime, probably because a kid wont remember, or even want to, what happened in the last 20 somethin episodes that are all the same. there is a greater comparsion between anime and either drama/sci-fi shows like the x-files and buffy than there is to kim possible or hey arnold. its fair in some cases for example shin-chan, is aimed at kids and is basically an "anime cartoon".
on the subject of american style animation being more original, that is also a load of shit. every artist has his own style (well maybe not every one) and even if this style is incredibly like another artists style, its still not the same. like for example pepsi and coke are quite similar but most people know they aint the same, even though they have the same flavour. then you might say "all anime follows the same basic style, big eyes, small mouth, almost no nose and crazy hair", but american cartoons do this as well. there are certain rules that they all follow and thats just simply the way it is. you may think manga/anime artists all draw the same but i can tell different artists by their different styles. and "news flash" most characters drawn by the same artist look the same hence different style and colour of hair as well as each character wearing the same clothes all the time so that they are easy to recongise. dont try to tell me that a most characters in simpsons doesnt look basically the same except for theyre hair, clothes, and shape.
which smoothly brings me on to the conclusion of my rant, would you call the simpsons a cartoon?
Ok we need to Educate - morgorath - 06-18-2003
sanosuke Good points but you have to stop contradicting your self. Here ya go...
Quote: would over a quarter of America tune in to watch the last episode of rugrats? Is there even a last episode of rugrats? No because it?s not episodic like most anime, probably because a kid won?t remember, or even want to, what happened in the last 20 something episodes that are all the same.
Ok, then in your ending statement you said, (by the way I want you to know I agreed with you all the way up and to this point)
Quote: which smoothly brings me on to the conclusion of my rant; would you call the simpsons a cartoon?
Now look at your self. By your own statements yes the Simpsons would be a kiddy cartoon. You don't need to know anything about the past seasons. But it is centered towards adults, (look at it's time slot) and paying attention to the series yields bonuses like the Side Show Bob stick... if you have seen all those episodes (and know a thing or two about Frasier) the each and every gag is a little deeper...
Look I agree with you sanosuke and am in direct disagreement with kakomu, but we need to present a strong argument instead of shooting are self's in the foot...
Ok we need to Educate - kakomu - 06-18-2003
es I would call Japanese Anime Cartoons, and yes i do think that all Japanese cartoons look pretty freaking similar. Anyways, I don't subscribe to your views on what defines a cartoon, and what is out of the bounds of cartoondom. I still think that anything animated is a cartoon.
Things like Batman 's animated show are considered a cartoon, even if they are dark, brooding, serious and aimed at older audiences (middle school to high school). Also, I doubt that anime is aimed at adults. In Japan there comes a point in a person's life where they just stop watching anime (and it seems to happen quite frequently, John over at animenation talked about it I believe). The only difference I can see between Japanese cartoons and American cartoons is that Japanese cartoons have more of them, and they tend to be less episodic and end a lot quicker.
Ok we need to Educate - kakoi_sugoi_yama - 06-19-2003
How do you explain hentai?
Ok we need to Educate - kakomu - 06-19-2003
Pornographic Anime. Still a cartoon, just a pronographic cartoon.
Ok we need to Educate - Steve_the_Talking_Pie - 06-19-2003
*sigh* Anime translates to cartoon in Japan, or close to it. Anime when used by an English speaker refers solely to Japanese Animation. In Japan anime refers to any cartoon including Rugrats.
Kakomu, don't give me this tripe that anime is the same in appearance. I couldn't give a rat's ass if it did. The stories are different, which is sometimes hard to say about American Cartoons (a moral will be learned in every episode by the protagonist in an American show).
Also just because it is targeted at a certain age group doesn't mean anything. I know my friends and I watched X Files when we were rather young and my friend's parents were watching Disney movies.
Kakomu, your comment's shows what little you know. Anime can and will be targeted for adults. Look at Sazae-san, I'm sure little children would find episodes on mortgage payments funny. Why don't you ever watch international TV, Japanese adults praise Miyazaki and his work. Not to mention there are adults who love watching Astro Boy because they grew up on it (just as I love GI Joe). Exactly the point Kakoi brought up with hentai, he didnt ask if it was a "porn cartoon" or not. He was mentioning that despite no limiting laws on purchase age, hentai is not aired on early morning TV. It is placed on Video and sold to adults. What about Brother Dear Brother (if you have even heard of it), it was aired on late night TV and directed towards Business WOMEN!!!! Gee, there goes your crappy theory. Also adult genres can be seen in manga, There is housewife manga, salaryman manga, father manga, wife manga, teacher manga, etc. If you have an opinion make it, but back it up. That theory of anime is for kids in Japan, won't fly!!!!
Ok we need to Educate - kakomu - 06-19-2003
regardless of what you say, what adults watched when they're kids and whoever praises miyazaki, what we're arguing here boils down to one's own perception and definition. I never said anime was for kids (and to the contrary, I said "It just so happens that Japanese cartoons are aimed at teens") Afterwards, I said there is a point that people grow out of Japanese cartoons and cited a source. lastly, to call one's opinion crappy, and to insult me is uncalled for. Since when is arguing over the definition of cartoon worth name calling? It makes you look childish.
Lastly, it seems you are calling animated shows that are american "cartoons" and Animated shows that are Japanese as if there are some sort of defining factor that makes them ultimately different just because they were produced in a different region. If you're going to say that anime is not a cartoon based on who it's aimed at, why not at least conceed that other animes like Ranma, Azumanga daioh, Excel Saga and Nadesico (while may contain some themes aimed at older people in the 14-16 range) are ultimately just silly shows, and by your definition would place them into cartoon territory. Unless you want to make a fundamental difference: American animation is cartoon! Japanese Animation is NOT cartoon!
Edit: If you don't conceed the part of the argument, i refuse to argue since it seems you're seperating them solely on where they're made and nothing more.