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Ok, I finally bought a copy of The Machinist. I must say that it was more of a film that I expected & I was very pleased by it.

I also got around to buying a copy of American Psycho (also starring Bale). I had heard of how grusome the book was & that the movie itself was a watered down masterpiece. It sounded quite interesting, but in the end fell to very short. I've heard people argue about the ending to the film, and they've said that you must read the book to fully comprehend it, but I disagree. I understand what was happening, or I believe that I do because this movie tries so hard to be like every other great movie I've enjoyed. It tries to make you think about the results & what's happened, but the direction was horrible. First of all there was no character development, no real background information.
We're excepted to believe all of the history based off maybe 2 statements made by Batemen. The greatest piece of development is "I usaed to kill people at night, now I want to kill them during the daylight hours." That statement alone would explain the ending to the film.

The thing which I loved the most about the Machinist was the entire time I was watching it I felt that the movie wanted me to guess what was happening. This is missleading, becasue the question that is answered in a more suprizing & more satisfying manner is why is this happening.

Anyone have some movie suggestions, or just opinions you would like to share oon a few good movies?

Batz Kage Wrote:I also got around to buying a copy of American Psycho (also starring Bale). I had heard of how grusome the book was & that the movie itself was a watered down masterpiece. It sounded quite interesting, but in the end fell to very short. I've heard people argue about the ending to the film, and they've said that you must read the book to fully comprehend it, but I disagree. I understand what was happening, or I believe that I do because this movie tries so hard to be like every other great movie I've enjoyed. It tries to make you think about the results & what's happened, but the direction was horrible. First of all there was no character development, no real background information.
We're excepted to believe all of the history based off maybe 2 statements made by Batemen. The greatest piece of development is "I usaed to kill people at night, now I want to kill them during the daylight hours." That statement alone would explain the ending to the film.

The point you and 99.9% of other people are missing is that American Psycho isn't about a murderer, or one guy mental illness, or whatever! Hell Patrick Bateman isn't even the main character!!

The film is about the 1980's nothing more, the fact that bateman murders people is about as important as if he was a baker! Where in a more conventional movie the backdrop and setting would be unimportant, American Psycho reverses that and makes the setting and period the main character, but tries to mislead you through shock!

The fact that people including Bateman were so self important (worrying who's business card is better, or who's got the nicest apartment) makes all of the people in the film cold enough to do what it protrays Bateman doing, infact by them going out and spending and not helping other people (Bateman included by the end) this is exactly what they're doing albeit in a more round about way! (I mean where can Bateman go at the end, he dosen't exsist, he's just another power tie, he may aswell be dead! And it was his "friends" that killed him!!)

Anyone who sits and debates whether Bateman killed anyone at all, or even if he was infact Patrick Bateman is missing the point entirely... I personally tihnk it's a fantastic film, if flawed in comparison to the book...

Krooner

Krooner Wrote:The point you and 99.9% of other people are missing is that American Psycho isn't about a murderer, or one guy mental illness, or whatever! Hell Patrick Bateman isn't even the main character!!

The film is about the 1980's nothing more, the fact that bateman murders people is about as important as if he was a baker! Where in a more conventional movie the backdrop and setting would be unimportant, American Psycho reverses that and makes the setting and period the main character, but tries to mislead you through shock!

The fact that people including Bateman were so self important (worrying who's business card is better, or who's got the nicest apartment) makes all of the people in the film cold enough to do what it protrays Bateman doing, infact by them going out and spending and not helping other people (Bateman included by the end) this is exactly what they're doing albeit in a more round about way! (I mean where can Bateman go at the end, he dosen't exsist, he's just another power tie, he may aswell be dead! And it was his "friends" that killed him!!)

Anyone who sits and debates whether Bateman killed anyone at all, or even if he was infact Patrick Bateman is missing the point entirely... I personally tihnk it's a fantastic film, if flawed in comparison to the book...

Krooner

I realised all of this about 15 minutes after posting what I did, then spent the rest of the day thinking about the movie. So to speak, I think them adding the 'was it all real' option for interperitation was dumb, but the movie as a whole was a satirical master piece.

I must say that I didn't watch the movie hoping to see a mad man, I loved Rules of Attraction, & I knew what to expect with Bret-Easton's work. In retrospect, I should have thought a little mroe about the movie before saying I didn't like it.

I don't remember the name of it, but Bret-Easton also wrote a book about the writer of American Psycho losing his mind & killing people just the same XD

What I don't get is why a lot of people think that the second American Psycho movie couldn't have happened because 'Patrick never killed anyone'. That's not true, actually even if the entire movie was in his head, you must realise that the movie starts when he begins to kill people 'during the day' as he says. And to top it off the director said that they didn't truely intend for it to look like he never killed anyone.


I finally finished watching the Devil's Rejects. I must say that hte ending struggle between the cop & the hicks was entirely to predictible. How did Tiny find them? Uh-huh. They never contacted him, so how? 6th sense?

Other than that, it was a pretty decent movie. I mean the plot was do-able, & the execution was perfect, so all in all it was good.

Batz Kage Wrote:you must realise that the movie starts when he begins to kill people 'during the day' as he says. And to top it off the director said that they didn't truely intend for it to look like he never killed anyone.

I always took the "kill people during the day" thing to mean his Job, thus he'd be killing himself during the day, aswell as the people/companies he bankrupts... I've not seen it in a while though, I tried to watch 2 once but turned it off after about 20mins!

I've not seen The Devil's Rejects, although I love Horror, I'm intending to watch it and I saw 'House of 1000 corpses' but thought the ending was just wierd (why was Dr Wolfenstein there?)

I really want to see 'Hostel' and bought that on DVD just recently, along with 'The Hills Have Eyes' I loved Alexadre Aja's 'Haute Tension' even though it was a little predictable, if 'Hills' is half as good then I should be in for a treat!

I never get anytime to watch Horror though, my girlfriend always want's to watch "Nice films" or "One's were girls kick ass!" which resulted in me having to watch 'Bewitched' and 'Domino' back to back... Both sucked, but at least 'Bewitched' made me laugh because it was intentionally funny...

Krooner

Krooner Wrote:I always took the "kill people during the day" thing to mean his Job, thus he'd be killing himself during the day, aswell as the people/companies he bankrupts... I've not seen it in a while though, I tried to watch 2 once but turned it off after about 20mins!

I've not seen The Devil's Rejects, although I love Horror, I'm intending to watch it and I saw 'House of 1000 corpses' but thought the ending was just wierd (why was Dr Wolfenstein there?)

I really want to see 'Hostel' and bought that on DVD just recently, along with 'The Hills Have Eyes' I loved Alexadre Aja's 'Haute Tension' even though it was a little predictable, if 'Hills' is half as good then I should be in for a treat!

I never get anytime to watch Horror though, my girlfriend always want's to watch "Nice films" or "One's were girls kick ass!" which resulted in me having to watch 'Bewitched' and 'Domino' back to back... Both sucked, but at least 'Bewitched' made me laugh because it was intentionally funny...

Krooner

I've read that in the book, Patrick tries to get caught a few times. I take this to mean that he actually had killed people, but you do have an interesting point.
As for the second one, I've read so many bad reviews about it that I'll probably never touch it. The idea that a little girl could kill Patrick alone is reason enough not to dislike it.

Also, do you notice that when he tells the lady near the end of the movie that he wants to know what had happened there she is taken back by it & instantly tells him to leave. That was Alan's apartment, right? According to the lawyer Allen was still alive so why were they getting ready to sell his apartment if he was just on vacation?

I've never seen House of 1,000 Corpses, but I've heard it was good. Pretty much any Zombie film is going to be good; he's so rich till the point that he doesn't care about making his films mainstream (save for the rated versions).

The thing I didn't like about the Devil's Rejects is you're expected to route for the Rejects. I on the other hand sat & counted all the times their victims could have easily slit their throats. If there had been more of them for fodder, or if the movie was more realistic, then I believe the Rejects would have been dropping more like flies... Good movie none the less.

Hostel bored me, it was a predictible reprocessed Saw. As soon as I saw the guy on the train I knew who he was. Then the whole thing of setting the 'wild guy' of the two good guys up with a trama plea so he could infact be likable enough to make him into the hero also made the movie predictible.


Well this conversation quickly went from good movies to good horror movies

I think I'm about to rewatch American Psycho with the comentary again. I tried to listen to it while I was laying in bed last night, but that didn't work long.

Batz Kage Wrote:I've read that in the book, Patrick tries to get caught a few times. I take this to mean that he actually had killed people, but you do have an interesting point.
As for the second one, I've read so many bad reviews about it that I'll probably never touch it. The idea that a little girl could kill Patrick alone is reason enough not to dislike it.

Also, do you notice that when he tells the lady near the end of the movie that he wants to know what had happened there she is taken back by it & instantly tells him to leave. That was Alan's apartment, right? According to the lawyer Allen was still alive so why were they getting ready to sell his apartment if he was just on vacation?

I've never seen House of 1,000 Corpses, but I've heard it was good. Pretty much any Zombie film is going to be good; he's so rich till the point that he doesn't care about making his films mainstream (save for the rated versions).

The thing I didn't like about the Devil's Rejects is you're expected to route for the Rejects. I on the other hand sat & counted all the times their victims could have easily slit their throats. If there had been more of them for fodder, or if the movie was more realistic, then I believe the Rejects would have been dropping more like flies... Good movie none the less.

Hostel bored me, it was a predictible reprocessed Saw. As soon as I saw the guy on the train I knew who he was. Then the whole thing of setting the 'wild guy' of the two good guys up with a trama plea so he could infact be likable enough to make him into the hero also made the movie predictible.


Well this conversation quickly went from good movies to good horror movies

I think I'm about to rewatch American Psycho with the comentary again. I tried to listen to it while I was laying in bed last night, but that didn't work long.

Yes I think that's (although inintentionally) the most confusing scene in the movie, why does she looked shocked at what happened? Why is the apartment up for sale?? And if he chased a screaming hooker through the corridors with a chiansaw, then (A) Why didn't anyone hear him? And (B) Why weren't the police all over the building the following day??

No, I think it's safe to assume Patrick killed Alan. That the lawyer says he's alive is unimportant! Don't forget this is the same lawyer that dosen't even recognise Bateman (agian most likely because of his own self importance a bit of a theme?), not a very reliable witness is he? It could have been someone else entirely...

It's been an awful long time since I read the book, 1998 maybe!?!? I don't really remember much about it other than being shocked, dispite the book being less graphic, particularly the threesome scene as I remember... The book just tells you "Tonight I'll use the coathanger..." (forgive me paraphrasing, my mind is hazy) Still a great book though, the movie too! I wouldn't know the awesome-ness of Huey Lewis and the Hews' Hip to Be Square where it not for American Psycho

1000 Corpses is OK, a bit style over substance! But different enough and visually vibrant enough to hold your attention, I'd have though you'd have watched it before Rejects, but then I don't suppose it's integral to you're enjoyment of the sequel... Is he doing another one with them?

Dude! watch the spoilers, I've not watched Hostal yet! LOL!!

The Descent is a good horror film, it's been out on DVD a long while over here. But I think you guys are just getting it in cinemas over in the states/canada! I really enjoyed Wolfs Creek too, really good bad guy in that one! And A Tale Of Two Sisters a Korean horror movie, that's excellent too!!

Yes, we have kind of slipped down a horror side road! So in order to try and steer us back in to more neutral waters, what are your (and anyone else reading) top 5 movies?? As for myself;

Swingers
This Is Spinal Tap
The Evil Dead
Fight Club
The Iron Giant

Krooner

Krooner Wrote:1000 Corpses is OK, a bit style over substance! But different enough and visually vibrant enough to hold your attention, I'd have though you'd have watched it before Rejects, but then I don't suppose it's integral to you're enjoyment of the sequel... Is he doing another one with them?

Dude! watch the spoilers, I've not watched Hostal yet! LOL!!

The Descent is a good horror film, it's been out on DVD a long while over here. But I think you guys are just getting it in cinemas over in the states/canada! I really enjoyed Wolfs Creek too, really good bad guy in that one! And A Tale Of Two Sisters a Korean horror movie, that's excellent too!!

Yes, we have kind of slipped down a horror side road! So in order to try and steer us back in to more neutral waters, what are your (and anyone else reading) top 5 movies?? As for myself;

Swingers
This Is Spinal Tap
The Evil Dead
Fight Club
The Iron Giant

Krooner

Sorry for the spoilers in Hostel, but trust me as soon as you see the parts I'm talking about you'll instantly get the same impression; like the movie was going for a new approch to herotics & the twist is generic substance covered in gore. That might be an exaduration as I didn't like the film & could not even finish it.

As for there being a new chatper to Rob Zombie's movies; I think the answer to that in itself would be a spoiler, but his next project, if I remember correctly, is re-doing the first Halloween movie. New characters & a new plot, so the fuyn hasn't stopped yet.

I read that the American Psycho book was so very much more grusome than the movie. Like a scene where he releases starving rats onto a girl who has been nailed to the floor. Does it jsut tell you the set up for the murder with no details, or what?
That was probably the most disappointing part of the movie, all the murders that were taken out. And in the commentary, who the director keeps saying that the movie can be taken either way; either he was a murderer or he wasn't, then she makes constant remarks about how they decided to add this & that to make the idea that it was all in his head more dominit.
To me it said: Well now you can take it either way because we added more evidence that it's the other way.


My top 5 favorite movies...hmm, well it's constantly changing, but I love:

Evil Dead 2
Evil Dead
The Machinist
Fight Club
Matchstick Men
Boondock Saints

The problem is, a lot of the movies I enjoy the most are movies like Fight Club & The Machinist which to me are great the first time you watch them, & only good the following times.


While on the subject of film; I wish they would make an X-Men movie about Gambit. All the rumors said we was considered for the first & third movie, but only got his name in the second one. He may not be the most popular X-Men character, but he's atleast one of the top 10 (I'd wish to say top 5, but that would be pushing it).

And another movie I liked, but forgot to mention is Butterfly Effect. When it came out, I stupidly enough took the advice of fellow classmates & avoided it. I have since learned that if it isn't the newest movie full of explosions, or consisting of a romantic-comedy, then the inhabbitants of this small town consider it to be stupid -_-

Batz Kage Wrote:Sorry for the spoilers in Hostel, but trust me as soon as you see the parts I'm talking about you'll instantly get the same impression; like the movie was going for a new approch to herotics & the twist is generic substance covered in gore. That might be an exaduration as I didn't like the film & could not even finish it.

As for there being a new chatper to Rob Zombie's movies; I think the answer to that in itself would be a spoiler, but his next project, if I remember correctly, is re-doing the first Halloween movie. New characters & a new plot, so the fuyn hasn't stopped yet.

I read that the American Psycho book was so very much more grusome than the movie. Like a scene where he releases starving rats onto a girl who has been nailed to the floor. Does it jsut tell you the set up for the murder with no details, or what?
That was probably the most disappointing part of the movie, all the murders that were taken out. And in the commentary, who the director keeps saying that the movie can be taken either way; either he was a murderer or he wasn't, then she makes constant remarks about how they decided to add this & that to make the idea that it was all in his head more dominit.
To me it said: Well now you can take it either way because we added more evidence that 'it's the other way.


My top 5 favorite movies...hmm, well it's constantly changing, but I love:

Evil Dead 2
Evil Dead
The Machinist
Fight Club
Matchstick Men
Boondock Saints

The problem is, a lot of the movies I enjoy the most are movies like Fight Club & The Machinist which to me are great the first time you watch them, & only good the following times.


While on the subject of film; I wish they would make an X-Men movie about Gambit. All the rumors said we was considered for the first & third movie, but only got his name in the second one. He may not be the most popular X-Men character, but he's atleast one of the top 10 (I'd wish to say top 5, but that would be pushing it).

And another movie I liked, but forgot to mention is Butterfly Effect. When it came out, I stupidly enough took the advice of fellow classmates & avoided it. I have since learned that if it isn't the newest movie full of explosions, or consisting of a romantic-comedy, then the inhabbitants of this small town consider it to be stupid -_-

Can't say I agree with you on the Butterfly Effect issue, my girlfriend loved it, I've seen the original French version but I actually fell asleep during the Ashton Kutcher remake! Same with the Ring movies, alot of people I know though the remake was great and I'd seen the Japanese original in like '98/'99 and kept telling them "You've got to see the original, it's way better!" ... Everyone I told hated the original!! It seems to be which ever one you saw first you prefer, still their loss!!

I miss Gambit in the X-men movies too! I loved the guy in the comics and animated series and even though he wasn't great in it always used to put him in my teams on 'X-men VS Street Fighter'

I never really like the first X-men movie though, loved the second! And felt the third was a bit of a step back for the series... I hear it's the last on they'll make, which is a shame, as there's plenty of characters I'd still like to see! Apocolypse, Mr Sin would be awesome bad guys... In all honestyy I'm a Batman guy myself though!

That there is a nice top 6! Really enjoyed Boondock! Shame they never got the sequel of the ground, the documentry about the director/writer (I forget it's name) is a good watch too, that and the film actually come as a 2 disc special edition over here!! I really enjoyed 'The Machinist' too! Excellent film awesome performance (again) by Bale don't think he'll ever quite shake Bateman though, the same way Brad Pitt will never shake Tyler (in my eyes anyway)

Have you seen Memento? I get a feeling from what you said about the movies you like that you'd dig it...

Yes upon thinking about ti the novel is perhaps a little more grusome, but can a book truly be graphic?? The picture only exsist in your head... I think it probebly says more about the person than the material.

Alot of the murders you're just told about, it's not written. But then as said before it's not about the murders, it's about him getting away with it because of the people around him being ignorant, I think that's more apparent in the book than it is in the movie...

Krooner

Krooner Wrote:That there is a nice top 6! Really enjoyed Boondock! Shame they never got the sequel of the ground, the documentry about the director/writer (I forget it's name) is a good watch too, that and the film actually come as a 2 disc special edition over here!! I really enjoyed 'The Machinist' too! Excellent film awesome performance (again) by Bale don't think he'll ever quite shake Bateman though, the same way Brad Pitt will never shake Tyler (in my eyes anyway)

Have you seen Memento? I get a feeling from what you said about the movies you like that you'd dig it...

Yes upon thinking about ti the novel is perhaps a little more grusome, but can a book truly be graphic?? The picture only exsist in your head... I think it probebly says more about the person than the material.

Alot of the murders you're just told about, it's not written. But then as said before it's not about the murders, it's about him getting away with it because of the people around him being ignorant, I think that's more apparent in the book than it is in the movie...

Krooner

We got the speical 2-disc ed. of Boondock Saints, & there was a rumor spreading at the time of its release that the funds would finish the filming of All Saints Day, but that still has yet to come.

Memento is actually on my list of movies to buy, along with Equlibrium & I wish I could find a copy of Ricky 6, but alas it's not inprint & the only dvd release I can find is a fan ed. bootleg.


I just watched American Psycho again and what the co-writer pointed out was that Patrick Bateman is Sean Bateman's brother. Sean Bateman is one of the main characters from Rules of Attraction, which is just a very cool fact to know. Also she said that in the book Patrick talks with his mother & brother.
If any of you have never seen Rules of Attraction I would definetly suggest you watch it. It's a stroy about sex, drugs, & love in college. The director did an excellent job, everything about it was just top notch. I have it on dvd somewhere.

Krooner Wrote:I miss Gambit in the X-men movies too! I loved the guy in the comics and animated series and even though he wasn't great in it always used to put him in my teams on 'X-men VS Street Fighter'

Gambit was supposed to be in the third X-Men movie. They offered the role to one of the characters from "LOST", but the actor said that he declined the role because Gambit and his character from "LOST" were too similar. At the time that I read about it, I've never seen "LOST", but now I would assume the person that they tried casting was the same guy that played "Sawyer". So since he declined the role, Gambit didn't appear in the 3rd installment.

Batz Kage Wrote:We got the speical 2-disc ed. of Boondock Saints, & there was a rumor spreading at the time of its release that the funds would finish the filming of All Saints Day, but that still has yet to come.

Memento is actually on my list of movies to buy, along with Equlibrium & I wish I could find a copy of Ricky 6, but alas it's not inprint & the only dvd release I can find is a fan ed. bootleg.


I just watched American Psycho again and what the co-writer pointed out was that Patrick Bateman is Sean Bateman's brother. Sean Bateman is one of the main characters from Rules of Attraction, which is just a very cool fact to know. Also she said that in the book Patrick talks with his mother & brother.
If any of you have never seen Rules of Attraction I would definetly suggest you watch it. It's a stroy about sex, drugs, & love in college. The director did an excellent job, everything about it was just top notch. I have it on dvd somewhere.

Yeah I knew about the Rules of Attraction thing! I liked the movie, but I don't think it stands up to repeated veiwings!! It's really well done though, a really good adaptation...

I didn't think they'd shot any of 'Boondock 2' that some's been shot and is out there is a good thing I guess, perhaps we'll see it someday...

I've seen Ricky 6 (it was on TV over here about a year ago) I like that sort of true crime kind of thing, I hope it get's a DVD release, but alot of films like that go straight into syndication and are rarely seen again

I didn't like Equilibrium when I first saw it, but enjoyed it more the second time around, I think I went in expecting soething and was disappointed when I got something else, I think it's a solid 3 star movie though...

Krooner

Psygnius Wrote:Gambit was supposed to be in the third X-Men movie. They offered the role to one of the characters from "LOST", but the actor said that he declined the role because Gambit and his character from "LOST" were too similar. At the time that I read about it, I've never seen "LOST", but now I would assume the person that they tried casting was the same guy that played "Sawyer". So since he declined the role, Gambit didn't appear in the 3rd installment.

I don't watch Lost either, although I'd like too! I just keep forgetting!!

I think it's a real shame we didn't see Gambit, I think the fanboys wanted him as much as Angel/Archangel, I think they could have had alot of fun with the character and his abilities, that said I think the wasted Colossus! What we did see effects-wise was really cool, I'd have been happy to watch more...

Krooner

OMG!!!

I wish I had come back earlier you are talking about some of my favs.
-Evil dead 2- greatest movie of all time tied only with army of darkness
-Machinist great movie- Bale is insanely method, the director of psycho nicknamed him roboactor
-american psycho-satire about how obsessive everyone was in the 80's(thats it in a nutshell) bateman is simply a tool to convey this, bale manages to add a very amusing performance to a shallow character.
About the scene at the apartment, I think thats meant to show how greedy the broker is that they would cover up what happened so they can sell such a great apartment right away.

Its the same with starship troopers a lot of people called verhoven a facist for this but none of them got that it's a satire about a facist society using boobs and blood to make it amusing.

Anyone who liked American Psycho might like I Shot Andy Warhol, from the same director. (Mary Harron) Stars Lili Taylor. Good film.

geo85 Wrote:OMG!!!

I wish I had come back earlier you are talking about some of my favs.
-Evil dead 2- greatest movie of all time tied only with army of darkness
-Machinist great movie- Bale is insanely method, the director of psycho nicknamed him roboactor
-american psycho-satire about how obsessive everyone was in the 80's(thats it in a nutshell) bateman is simply a tool to convey this, bale manages to add a very amusing performance to a shallow character.
About the scene at the apartment, I think thats meant to show how greedy the broker is that they would cover up what happened so they can sell such a great apartment right away.

Its the same with starship troopers a lot of people called verhoven a facist for this but none of them got that it's a satire about a facist society using boobs and blood to make it amusing.

What's with the likeing ED2 over ED1!!! 2's just a remake! Evil Dead is what broke the mould, and what they did effects-wise with the money they had is breathtaking!

I agree with troopers great satire, same with verhoven's Robocop and to an extent Total Recall, all the society's depicted are very shallow and product minded similar to Psycho actually...

Krooner